(Interview) – It’s been 23 years since the nationwide uprising broke out in 1988. Student leader Than Doke believes the aspirations for democracy and hatred of the military dictatorship are still powerful forces in the minds of student activists. Than Doke worked as a leader in his native town of Kyaukse during the 88 uprising and currently serves as the chief of the Mae Sot-based Burma Labour Solidarity Organization. Mizzima reporter Tun Tun talked to him about the 1988 uprising, the attitude of students today, the new Parliament, pro-democracy forces, ethnic people, the emergence of a new generation and the future of the country.
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Question: How does the will of the people during the 1988 uprising compare with today?Answer: The democracy loving spirit and discontent and hatred against military dictatorship by the people during 1988 uprising is still deeply rooted in the mind of the people. Though 23 years have passed, we do not yet see any indication of change in this regard. The 2007 Saffron Revolution proved that. Another example can be seen at the time of Aung San Suu Kyi’s release from her house arrest. The people were so active on that day and showed how eager they were to see democracy flourish. The people know well their plight and their hardships are because of the military dictatorship. They want to be freed from the yoke of this military dictatorship. We must keep in mind that the people are exploring the way to freedom from the dictatorship.
Q: What do you mean the people are exploring their way to freedom?
A: The labour rights movement is frequently arising in the Rangoon industrial zones. These are the voices of the people calling for democracy. Despite the repression and frequent and rampant arrests made by the government, the number of political prisoners is not yet decreasing. The underground movements of distribution of leaflets and pamphlets are found even in the high security zones such as Insein railway factory and Burma Pharmaceutical Industry.
Q: What about the awareness of people in 1988 and today?
A: I think the anti-dictatorship movements and pro-democracy movements of the people by all possible means at their disposal are more active than in 1988. I believe the people are awaiting the right moment and opportunity for their struggle. The people expressed their desire for democracy by sacrificing their lives in this 8888 uprising. And then again in the 1990 general election, they showed their will and desire by their ballots but the people’s verdict was not honoured and the regime lied to the people again. So the people know well. The people opened their eyes and ears for the final struggle to overthrow the military dictatorship once and for all. The people are determined to fight for their final struggle at any cost and any sacrifice.
Q: What are the differences and similarities between students in 1988 and students today?
A: The similarity of the situation then and now is the students are still under the oppression of the military dictatorship. An anti-dictatorship spirit is still firmly in the mind of the students today. This is the students’ spirit of anti-repression and anti-submissive spirit.
Q: How about the situation today in terms of getting an education?
A: I think the students today have to struggle more for their education than in the past. They have to struggle more economically, socially and in all aspects. At the same time, the level of education standards in Burma is falling. In the meantime, the world is moving at full speed in the computer and high-tech age so the students in Burma have to try hard to catch up with the world. I respect their motivation without any aid. I feel good to see them increase their capacity by themselves as through extra-curriculum activity. But the dropout rate in schools keeps falling.
Q: Do you see any indications of the emergence of a new generation of leadership in the pro-democracy forces and ethnic people?
A: The new generation leadership emerges in every age so the political movements are handed over from generation by generation. The new leadership will lead the new age. It is certain we will hand over our national duty in politics and economics to a new generation of young people.
Q: Do you think a new student leader like Min Ko Naing will emerge?
A: The student leader Min Ko Naing was a new generation leader of our 8888 uprising and he was tested and tried many times during these years. We have no doubt of the emergence of a new generation of leaders like Min Ko Naing for the next generation. Such leaders will certainly emerge.
Q: Do you see the newly installed government and some pro-democracy MPs as lowering the will of the people to be activists?
A: The people know well the current parliamentary democracy government led by Thein Sein is installed by a sham Parliament and Constitution. In fact, the winning party in the 1990 general election was the NLD and it should have formed a government but the government nullified the people’s election. This is the blatant denial of the will and desire of the people’s aspiration for democracy.
The people know well their future can be achieved only through revolution that will overthrow the military dictatorship. They realize that this is the sole way for a political breakthrough. I think the people will launch more opposition movements against this Thein Sein-led government.
Q: Do you think the current Constitution and political structure has weakened the freedom and the right to self-determination of ethnic people?
A: The ethnic people know they cannot get their self-determination and freedom under this Thein Sein government. The civil war was renewed and has resurged and there are many war refugees including children fleeing their homes. They have no food and no shelter in this monsoon rain. They are facing many hardships under this government but in the meantime the armed struggles of the ethnic people are gaining momentum and they are more unified, I think.
Q: How do you see the current fighting between government and ethnic troops?
A: Numerically, the Thein Sein’s government might have strong troops. But this is just the numerical strength. However, the numerical strength cannot become a deciding strength unless they are right. Might is not right. Supremacy of arms and troop strength can never weaken the ethnic armed forces. The standard of the current government forces has been lowered more than to a mercenary level. There are many deserters and the quality of their army is deteriorating. And then they also have suffered defeats in this fighting.
Q: Do you think the government will allow Suu Kyi to do more activities? Or do you think the recent warning by the government is the signal for a forthcoming suppression of her activities?
A: Thein Sein’s government wants to put Aung San Suu Kyi under house arrest again, if possible. I think they let her do what she is currently doing because they cannot do otherwise. They want to put her under house arrest again and they want to crush the NLD and the Committee Representing People’s Parliament (CRPP) totally once and for all if they can, and if there is opportunity to do so.
Q: Do you see any prospects for a dialogue?
A: Don’t forget they rekindle the fire of the civil war again. We cannot see any hope for the release of political prisoners like student leader Min Ko Naing and ethnic leader Khun Tun Oo. This proves their true intention. We must see this is the real political attitude. We don’t see yet any sign of engaging in a dialogue for finding a political solution by this government. I think they will continue using confrontation by violent means.
Q: The current government is trying to take the Asean chair in 2014. Should it be supported or opposed?
A: I wish that Asean was a strong organization that respected values of democracy and human rights, abiding with good ethics. They will give equal status to the repressive Thein Sein’s government as long as they are adhering to their dogmatic principle of non-interference in member countries’ affairs and emphasizing this principle. I think we should oppose the Asean chairmanship by the Burmese government because it was not elected by the people.
Q: Economic sanctions are due in part to the consequences of the 88 uprising. The government and some people are saying that it hurts the people only. Do you support sanctions?
A: I grew up in the age of the Burma Socialist Programme Party (BSPP). When I look back, I realize that our country was deteriorating day by day after 1962 when Ne Win took power by a coup. This situation is at the worst stage today. It’s not true the people are affected because of these international economic sanctions. For instance, I visited local cooperative society shops frequently during this BSPP rule when I was too young to buy low grade Nga Sein rice with lots of paddy with husks. My mother sent me to this shop to buy this low grade rice by standing in a long queue. We had to buy fish paste that was hard like a stone from this shop too. Before selling them, they had to be crushed by a one-viss weight (3.6 lbs) used in weighing. We had to consume it no matter what we liked or not. The laundry soap bars sold from these shops were twisted and hard but we had to use them too. I mean our country has been in a deteriorating situation and very poor since I was young.
Q: What about the international trade?
A: Fair trade cannot be possible under the rule of this government. There are many companies in the world that focus only on earning profits by exploiting people. Before we can adopt fair investment laws and regulations, this selfish Burmese government is misusing the natural resources by selling them as they wish. So it’s good to support sanctions imposed on this government. Let them be lifted and you will see the government and some companies in collusion exploit the people as they wish. They will get a license to exploit the people.
Q: So in the next two years will the country be better or worse?
A: I think we have to work hard to expect the situation to be in better shape. Thein Sein’s government will not relinquish its power easily. Good or bad depends on us. The change can be achieved only through a mass struggle. The situation in Burma will over time be better. The military dictatorship will one day cease totally. I think this day is not far from now.
